Sunday, June 6, 2010

Seeking An Honest Woman

Another Jdate woman. Another (iced) coffee for first date. And another lie about marital status.

As has happened 4 times now in the last year, a woman contacts me, online profile says "divorced".  She confesses on or before first date, "... I have a get but not a civil divorce.".

I'm tired of giving points for 'fessing up on first dates. When I ask as gently as possible why the mis-information, I get no coherent response. It's either insecurity about starting to date again after end of a marriage, or revenge dating, or they think separation means they are immediately ready to date again.

Sorry, I will not be the rebound guy. I will not be the "just dating for fun" target. I've always been happy to spend time alone if there was nobody special in my life.

I've turned down multiple fix-ups recently because the marital status was not "free and clear". I don't need to get married tomorrow (though I wouldn't turn down the right woman who proposes to me).

But a suitable date for me needs to be honest with herself before she can be honest with me.

3 comments:

  1. yes, people get a bit misguided when they are not fully divorced. i have met alot of men who are pretending to be single but have not yet given their wives gets. at least these women tell you their situation. too bad they couldnt do it before you actually met.

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  2. I don't get why you seem to think that a woman who hasn't gotten her civil divorce isn't ready to date or remarry. That she's 'revenge' dating or that of course you must be her rebound. It's not true. A get is a simple process where you go down to the B"D and spend an hour, then walk out with your halachic divorce finalized. A civil divorce is something that is shlepped out in the courts (particularly if you live in NY which does not accept "no fault" divorces) whether you want it to be or not. A woman who says she's divorced and has a get isn't lying. And kudos to her for being honest on or before the first date about her civil status, realizing that some men may not be comfortable dating her or may worry about how long the civil divorce could take. Those ARE honest women. If you don't want to date them, no problem (you might want to state so in your profile), but please don't accuse them of lying or game playing. They're just trying to move on with their lives and realize that it's not a dealbreaker for all men, even if it is for you.

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  3. @Shavy: For better or worse, I have much experience dating separated and divorced women, including "get but no civil divorce". And let me tell you that it takes time after both separation, get, and divorce for a person to get over the disappointment of the end of marriage, re-enter the dating world, face up to a B''D and get that can be emotionally draining, then the sometimes acrimonious process of making arrangements for division of marital assets, support payments, custody arrangements, etc.

    That's before considering that somebody married 20 years will be nervous and insecure about entering the dating world once again. ESPECIALLY if they were frum from birth, dated and married the frum way, and thus dated few times and few people before getting married, before the age of "internet dating", and the corroding influence of pop (i.e. dating for fun) culture on single people since they first got married.

    If other people are OK with dating people who have "get but no divorce" more power to them. In my substantial experience, even women separated a long time (2 or 3 years) before divorce THINK they are ready to date seriously again, but they are not.

    Frumster.com requires as condition of membership that previously married people MUST have both get and civil divorce (which hasn't stopped women on there from lying about marital status). Why is that?

    It's because dating the frum way REQUIRES being free and clear. A shadchun told me that that no shadchun in the frum world would set up somebody who does not have both get and civil divorce. They know what I know.

    People like me who are dating for marriage, in the frum way, do NOT want to date somebody who not only lies from start but also is so insecure to lie about some significant information. That is NOT in the realm of good middos, is it?

    It seems to me that somebody willing to date a legally married person (get or not), or date somebody so insecure as to lie about some important information, is NOT serious about dating for marriage.

    Just my opinion based on my experience, which is the point of this blog. :)

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